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SURGE
02-24-2006, 06:06 AM
Dislaimer: This statement was written in haste after I saw the announcement so if I come off too harsh my appologies:

Well people it seems like Pepsi has gone on the offensive once again again VAULT. One thing I have always found funny about Pepsi is how they usually resort to childish antics to libel their competitors in commercials. From the "Pepsi and Coke guy in a dinner" to the current Jackie-Chan Diet ads Pepsi always would prefer to make their competitor look weak instead of actually promoting the positives of their own brands.

Apparently this slanderious means of advertising has snuck into the the current Dew signage which contains gems like like this ebay bid (http://cgi.ebay.com/MOUNTAIN-DEW-VAULT-Controversial-Ad-Poster_W0QQitemZ7218378269QQcategoryZ10808QQssPage NameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) this ebay bid:

http://www.vaultkicks.org/dewposter.jpg

Funny that Pepsi has managed to rippoff the Coke Superbowl Full-Throttle ad at the same time as lamely slamming Vault. While admitedly the FT ad was a very Pepsi-like cheap-shot its still sad to see them shamelessly knock it off only a few weeks later. Also it seems that the Dew ad guys have forgotten that Vault has been promoted since the beginning by International CXT trucks which are the largest non-semi trucks on the market.

To me this ad says a couple things:
1.MDX is dead- notice it is Dew vs. VAULT not MDX
2. Pepsi is scared- don't listen to their PR machine or the Dew nuts. The numbers that we have which are minimal show it- and even more telling has been the price cuts and counter attacks.

In the end I hope that Pepsi chooses to take the highroad from here on out and push for innovation and competition. No matter if Coke gets it right this time or the next some day Dew will see some competition, and the current attitude will IMHO not help assure a continued dominance.

Mr Zabe
02-24-2006, 06:48 AM
Venting means never having to be sorry. :D

IMO...negative smear adds in general are not effective for soda pops. The mass public buys what tastes good and what is affordable. It does seem that the Pepsi (Mountain brand) does appear very threatened and wants to scare its core drinkers from not trying Vault.

IMO this add encourages MD drinks to try Vault. LOL From the reaction of the handful of borad mates who have tried Vault, it would seem that MD has a reason to be scared. Like I have said, I have been a MD drinker for years. I still drink it. However, after a week of drinking Vault IMO,Vault has been rocking my world. I just can't get over how it has such strong yet drinkable taste notes.

Torn between two lovers, feeling line a Vault man in love. smile.gif :cool: smile.gif

[ 02-24-2006, 05:50 AM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

the saint
02-24-2006, 06:49 AM
"Dislaimer: This statement was written in haste after I saw the announcement so if I come off too harsh my appologies:"
What kind of crap is this?? If you don't like your post hit the edit and delete it. You want to bash something but don't want to get called on it is what I think.

That is actually an internal poster, not an ad campaign poster. The person selling that on ebay is a Pepsi employee no doubt. As far as what the ad says

1)Also as I have stated before MDX is NOT competition of any kind to vault. vault is a dew knockoff, period. MDX is a hybrid, which obviously YOU do not understand. MDX is a combination of Dew and an ACTUAL ENERGY drink. Read the labels, you will se that the 2 products are not even remotly the same other than the HFCS and carbonated water etc. So why would Pepsi put Mdx on an internal sales rally poster that is against vauly taking away from DEW??


2) As I have stated on here before, Pepsi is not scared of vault, but if vault takes just 1 % of Dews sales that is equal to $20,000,000 + a year. How would you like to lose that kind of coin?? Pepsi doesn't anymore than anyone else.

It is funny reading your posts, you bash Pepsi for knocking at cokes lame attempt at a product and how "I hope that Pepsi chooses to take the highroad from here on out and push for innovation and competition. No matter if Coke gets it right this time or the next" but yet in YOUR signature YOU do the same thing.
Not to mention the countless others who post on here that say nothing good about any Pepsi product. How they all are "imitations" or how they are "imitators" or "copycats" but yet when Pepsi has a product that coke is attempting to copy a product that Pepsi has, Pepsi and any "DEW NUTS" should take the high road and welcome "innovation and competition".

My father used to always tell me an old saying "live by the sword, die by the sword" meaning in this incident, if you want to bash Pepsis products and bash Pepsi products, sooner or later you and a coke product will be the one getting bashed, deal with it and quit whining about "highroads" and "childish antics".

Mr Zabe
02-24-2006, 06:53 AM
Saint,
I see your points. smile.gif
I feel like I'm in the middle of stick ball fight.LOL
Zabe

the saint
02-24-2006, 07:00 AM
If you weren't so quick to post and let me get my longwinded posts wrote, you wouldn't be. hehe :D

pepsidew
02-24-2006, 07:26 AM
its better to attack attack attack vault by doing anything to maintain current dew drinkers then trying to get them back later. i have heard that in some areas where pepsi distributors sat back and watched what vault could do and they really got burned by good vault sales. pepsi is just doing what is right for the company.

i guess thats all i have to say about the subject smile.gif the saint pretty much covered all the bases for us

[ 02-24-2006, 06:28 AM: Message edited by: pepsidew ]

greg
02-24-2006, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by the saint:
"Dislaimer: This statement was written in haste after I saw the announcement so if I come off too harsh my appologies:"
What kind of crap is this?? If you don't like your post hit the edit and delete it. You want to bash something but don't want to get called on it is what I think.

That is actually an internal poster, not an ad campaign poster. The person selling that on ebay is a Pepsi employee no doubt. As far as what the ad says

1)Also as I have stated before MDX is NOT competition of any kind to vault. vault is a dew knockoff, period. MDX is a hybrid, which obviously YOU do not understand. MDX is a combination of Dew and an ACTUAL ENERGY drink. Read the labels, you will se that the 2 products are not even remotly the same other than the HFCS and carbonated water etc. So why would Pepsi put Mdx on an internal sales rally poster that is against vauly taking away from DEW??


2) As I have stated on here before, Pepsi is not scared of vault, but if vault takes just 1 % of Dews sales that is equal to $20,000,000 + a year. How would you like to lose that kind of coin?? Pepsi doesn't anymore than anyone else.

It is funny reading your posts, you bash Pepsi for knocking at cokes lame attempt at a product and how "I hope that Pepsi chooses to take the highroad from here on out and push for innovation and competition. No matter if Coke gets it right this time or the next" but yet in YOUR signature YOU do the same thing.
Not to mention the countless others who post on here that say nothing good about any Pepsi product. How they all are "imitations" or how they are "imitators" or "copycats" but yet when Pepsi has a product that coke is attempting to copy a product that Pepsi has, Pepsi and any "DEW NUTS" should take the high road and welcome "innovation and competition".

My father used to always tell me an old saying "live by the sword, die by the sword" meaning in this incident, if you want to bash Pepsis products and bash Pepsi products, sooner or later you and a coke product will be the one getting bashed, deal with it and quit whining about "highroads" and "childish antics". Good Post Saint.

The Cola "WARS" have been going on ever since I can remember. Furthermore, I think Coke has done their share of "bashing, childish, negative ads" over the years.
Do you think that for one minute if Coke had the upperhand with a High caffeine Citrus soda that they would just sit back and take it while Pepsi rolled out a monumental marketing campaign to knock them down a couple of points?
On another note...who do you think the target market is that Coke and Pepsi are trying to reach with these ads? It isn't the 45+ crowd with plenty of disposable income with hefty IRA's and a stock portfolio to match. They are going after the younger market that buys on impulse, image, and cost.That is one reason I feel like the ads are on the most base levels.

A talk show host in Atlanta said it best. You can always tell who the Car ads on the radio are targeting. The louder, faster, more obnoxious ads are geared to the younger, lower income, less educated bracket of society. While the more soothing, slower, artsy ads are geared to an older, more affluent & higher income, and better educated part of society.
Which one gets your attention?

SuperAmmo
02-24-2006, 09:20 AM
Is there anyone else like me who just buys what's on sale?

I drink both, like both, will get both depending on what the price is each week...

ramonazo
02-24-2006, 11:21 AM
One more of the long list of advertisements that Pepsi did in order to bother Coke...

Pepsi thinks that will make people laugh with those commercials, but those anti-Coke ads are getting more uncreative and boring than they are...

I rarely seen Coke making joke of Pepsi, with the exception of the Max Headroom New Coke commercial where Max interviews a can of Pepsi, and the "refrescadores" campaign in 1994 in the U.S. latin TV, where two detectives "confiscate" Pepsi and other cola cans to the people, and they gives them bottles of Coke...

But Coke realized that is better to be "the good guy of the movie" than the bad guy...

[ 02-24-2006, 10:22 AM: Message edited by: Ramón Coca-Colero ]

Mr Zabe
02-24-2006, 11:45 AM
SuperAmmo,
I'm pretty much a switch hitter soda pop drinker. I'm very spoiled here in Chi Town. I tend to drink whats on sale too.

CStoreCatMan
02-24-2006, 03:16 PM
I think Saint and Greg really made some solid points here. Is Pepsi going to sit back and watch Vault?? NO! Should they? Of course not...that would be bad business.

And of course you're going to see Dew get discounted and be a part of other promotions...someone else said it best - its easier to keep the current Dew drinkers than to try to win them back later.

Also, Saint also pointed out that this was an INTERNAL poster...which means it was meant to create some competitiveness and excitement amongst Pepsi employees. This was not on a billboard on the freeway. Someone else on this board has a Surge poster on their signature that does something very similar between Surge and Dew. However, the proof is in the pudding! Dew is still king...but Coke keeps trying!

Mr Nethead
02-24-2006, 04:17 PM
the saint wrote: "vault is a dew knockoff"

I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Vault tastes nothing like Mountain Dew. Just because it is the same type of soda doesn't mean it's a knockoff. If that were the case, Pepsi would be a Coke knockoff.

Anyway, I think PepsiCo is definitely worried. At the local grocery store they're now selling MDX at 2 for $1 and 20 oz bottles of Dew for 69 cents. Meanwhile, I looked at the huge stack of Vault crates, and it's not so huge anymore.

I used to drink Mountain Dew every now and then. But as long as Vault is around, I can't forsee myself ever drinking Dew again. It seems so flat, flavourless and weak in comparison to my beloved Vault!

iluvsurge220
02-24-2006, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by CStoreCatMan:
I think Saint and Greg really made some solid points here. Is Pepsi going to sit back and watch Vault?? NO! Should they? Of course not...that would be bad business.

And of course you're going to see Dew get discounted and be a part of other promotions...someone else said it best - its easier to keep the current Dew drinkers than to try to win them back later.

Also, Saint also pointed out that this was an INTERNAL poster...which means it was meant to create some competitiveness and excitement amongst Pepsi employees. This was not on a billboard on the freeway. Someone else on this board has a Surge poster on their signature that does something very similar between Surge and Dew. However, the proof is in the pudding! Dew is still king...but Coke keeps trying! Ok, why would pepsi discount Mountain Dew? They already have a billion people buying it. With Vault, Coke is selling it at low prices to get people to try it and hope they like it. Why would pepsi start selling MD at 2 for $1 when millions will buy it for regualar price?

iluvsurge220
02-24-2006, 04:23 PM
Other than that I feel like this is just stupid and there is no sense in arguing over it. The only thing I want to say is that I agree with all of you who say that Pepsi is always bashing coke and making it look bad while Coke really tries to be the good guy. Honestly, I can't recall a Coke commercial where they are NOT promoting their product and are instead letting everyone know how pepsi sucks. Yeah I am only 19 but still.

iluvsurge220
02-24-2006, 04:33 PM
Ok and to The Saint I have a couple of questions. First of all, how in heaven's name can you say that Vault is a knockoff of dew period? Vault in no way tastes anything like dew. They are two completely different products. Do you think that Surge tasted like Dew? Well, in case you don't know then I will tell you!!! No, it didn't. I will let you say that Vault is a knockoff of Surge as many times as you want because that is the truth. Surge/Vault taste nothing like dew, so don't say that it is a knockoff of dew. My second question is this. If pepsi isn't scared of Vault then why are they causing all this big commotion and making all these signs and whatnot over it? MD is a huge product, no one can argue against that. If I were part of Mountain Dew right now I would be thinking: "You know what, Vault might sell well, but Mountain Dew is a popular product everywhere, and we are still gonna make millions of dollars off of it every year. There is no reason for me to worry about this Vault product. Obviously, Pepsi is realizing that Vault is selling well and it probably will in the future as well. If they aren't scared then why did they create that sign or whatever to show to its employees? Was it just for fun The Saint? No I dont think so. I know I said that this was stupid to argue about so I will take back that statement now that I am becoming a part of the discussion, lol!! I just don't see how you can say those things, because the evidence makes them seem to be untrue.

pepsidew
02-24-2006, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by iluvsurge220:
[ Why would pepsi start selling MD at 2 for $1 when millions will buy it for regualar price? they are doing this to maintain their current customer base - if someone wants a soda and sees vault for 69 cents and dew is 1.29 - what do you think most people will grab? so if they price it close to what vault is then they will not lose as many sales. this has worked in different areas of the country. take a hit in margins now but keep your dew drinkers for the long term. sounds like a good idea to me

CStoreCatMan
02-24-2006, 04:58 PM
Its funny how different the opinions here are. Pepsi bashes Coke....they do not...etc etc. Who cares if Pepsi takes a shot at its competitor? Besides, its not the kind of dirty mudslinging we see with politicians...its usually light hearted comedy. If they get a few chuckles (or not)...so be it. If anyone actually takes personal offense to such ads...OMG...get a hobby. Besides...these ARE the COLA WARS!!!

Mello Yello Luver
02-24-2006, 05:00 PM
Pepsi stop complaining and picking on Coke. I'm sick of it. Anyway Vault is gona be around for a while and eventually every Mountain Dew drinker is gona try Vault and find out Vault tastes just as good as Mt. Dew (and maybe even better)

the saint
02-24-2006, 05:01 PM
1st question, Yeah and Pepsi tastes nothing like coke but yet most say it is a knockoff. Vanilla Pepsi taste nothing like vanilla coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. Diet Pepsi taste nothing like diet coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. Wild Cherry Pepsi taste nothing like cherry coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. I could go on and on and you will still say that vault is not a knockoff of Dew.
2nd Question, Do you honestly think that microsoft doesn't put out internal posters for sales rallys that are anti LINUX? How about WalMart having anti- Target posters? Ford vs. GM, Nabisco vs. Keebler, Heinz vs. Hunts, McDonalds vs. Burger King,...I could go on and on about this also. The sign was created in order to RALLY employees at a sales RALLY into excitement about a promotion. Yes it was for fun, it was to get the troops into kicking vaults a$$ just like surge and mello yello and whatever else coke decides to try.
MDX should not even be in this argument as using your own words "they are two completely different products" but just to appease you They are probably 2/$1 because they are more than likely close dated, OR maybe they are just on sale, did you think of that??? no you merely thought that it was because Pepsi is so scared of vault.As it was stated above it is easier to keep that to regain, so why not discount to keep consumers loyal??
You said you were only 19, I am not bashing you about your age I wish I was 19 again but you seriously have alot of growing up and seeing the world for what it is, Greedy, moneyhungry companies will stop at nothing until they have world domination. I have to go pick my daughter up from school now but i will be back to finish in a bit

pepsipimp
02-24-2006, 05:02 PM
Its no different than Wal-Mart posting the pictures of CEO's to their biggest competitors in their lobby...they are the biggest company in the world but they still keep an eye on the competition. To say that Coke doesn't think that Coke has not /does not make signage for internal use that promotes their product and pokes fun at pepsi's would be naive.

CStoreCatMan
02-24-2006, 05:10 PM
Exactly...again, I mentioned a member of this board with a signature containing a Surge sign (obviously posted at a Coke plant) that pokes fun at Mtn Dew. THEREFORE, COKE DOES THE SAME EXACT THING WHEN THEY WANT TO.

CStoreCatMan
02-24-2006, 05:12 PM
Now that I think about it...PLEASE let Coke put a LOT of focus on VAULT...

That way...Pepsi will continue to KICK Coke's butt in NON CARB which is where the market is trending. Thanks Coke! You're making my job easier.

mjb1124
02-24-2006, 05:47 PM
I guess I'm the only one who feels it's natural that Pepsi would take some shots at Vault, and that Coke should grow some balls and fight back, rather than just falling back on image, tradition, and whatnot.

Anyway, I think that Mountain Dew and Vault are both great products in their own ways. It is Mello Yello that should be halted. :D

Mr Nethead
02-24-2006, 05:52 PM
Originally posted by the saint:
1st question, Yeah and Pepsi tastes nothing like coke but yet most say it is a knockoff. Vanilla Pepsi taste nothing like vanilla coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. Diet Pepsi taste nothing like diet coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. Wild Cherry Pepsi taste nothing like cherry coke but yet people say it is a knockoff. I could go on and on and you will still say that vault is not a knockoff of Dew.
Okay. But if Vault is a knockoff of Mountain Dew then Mountain Dew is a knockoff of Sun Drop. Sun Drop also tastes better than Dew. tongue.gif

Mr Zabe
02-24-2006, 06:01 PM
What the heck happened here. I take a breif afternoon nap and I miss all the good banter.LOL

I may of said this before, good soda pops even in the same catagory will sell well. Mountain Dew is one of the most beloved soda pops of the modern area. I have and will always drink it. It tastes good and reminds me of my youth.

The jury is still out for Vault. I like it. I'm in lust with it. LOL I will buy it when it is on sale just like I buy MD on sale.

Both soda pops will do well. The mass public is in a win,win situation which is good. smile.gif

the saint
02-24-2006, 06:04 PM
Back to what I was saying...
You being 19, you probably grew up in the "positive reinforcment" period of teaching and discipline. So you probably don't know what it is like to not make the Baseball team you wanted to play on one year. Not because you weren't any good but because you were not good enough for them. You probably never got an "F" on any paper in school or sent to the principals for swats either. It is all the lawyers fault for taking the MONEY and filing lawsuits against the school districts and winning because their clients kid "wasn't a dumba$$ or bad player" he just was just slower. So the schools went to everyone passes regardless, everyone plays on the team regardless. The best were no longer the best but just another person.
Life isn't fair, you will not get a $100,000 year job out of school like you have probably been led to believe, you will not have a $500,000 house and a couple of $75,000 cars in the driveway.The world revolves around money like it or not and he who has the most wins.

Back in the 50s between GM and Ford there was about an 80% share of the market. That left the other 20 for everyone else as Gm and Ford did nothing. Fast forward 20 years GM and Ford dwindles to about a 60% share still they did nothing. Fast forward another 10 years GM and Ford barly hold 40% still they do nothing but put out junky cars. The competition sees this and while a car is a car Theirs are a bit cheaper and quality is better. Nowadays guess what GM and Ford are on the verge of Bankruptcy. Don't you think that they would go back 50 years if they could and squash the competition as little as it may have been at the time? What you ask does this have to do with soda? Well in your words "take the highroad..push for innovation and competition" Isn't that what Ford and GM did?? Now look at them, how many jobs are being cut??

Do you think that the Seahawks are happy with being the NFC champs? NO, I say they wanted the ring that says "WORLD CHAMPIONS"
It is all about winning, doesn't matter what it is in. Business, racing, football, baseball whatever you strive to be number one, PERIOD.
The thing is though if you crush the competition early on you don't have to worry about it knocking you off of your perch later.

[ 02-24-2006, 05:06 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

the saint
02-24-2006, 06:14 PM
And before any smartA$$ comments , YES I didn't make the raiders (best baseball team in town at the start of the year) one year. The team that I did end up playing for well we beat the snot out of the raiders for the championship that year.

YES I did receive my share of "Fs" on schoolwork, I never failed a grade or had anything lower than a b on a report card but I did get a few on regular work.

Finally I have received a grand total of 6 "swats" at school in my life. 2 different sets of 3. Once for getting into a fight and defending myself, the other for attempting to ditch out after lunch one day. As I was running across the parking lot to a buddies waiting car the principal angled across the lot and grabbed me before I made it, I wouldn't give up who was in the car(schoolyard code, you older guys know what I am talking about) , so 3 were mine that day. I have also been suspended one time for starting another fight.

Mr Zabe
02-24-2006, 06:22 PM
My two cents. LOL
I think what the main point is that play by the rules but monopolize on every possible advantage short of breaching ethical standards.

Perhaps there are generational difference due to all sorts of culture changing events. When I was 10 years old there were no PC's nota!!!! I went to college and had to learn how to use a primitive computer. LOL Now a days an average 10 year old is surfing the net and looking up porn sites. LOL It's just a different time and place.

This is not bad. When I played Little League base ball, we tied every tactic possible. I was the catcher, I use to call brush back pitches all the time. LOL Now a days I would be kicked out of the league by some angry parent.

I see Saint's point and I agree with it. smile.gif

[ 02-24-2006, 05:24 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

the saint
02-24-2006, 06:59 PM
Okay. But if Vault is a knockoff of Mountain Dew then Mountain Dew is a knockoff of Sun Drop. Sun Drop also tastes better than Dew. tongue.gif [/QB]I may be mistaken but I believe that Mountain Dew was invented in 1948 and Sundrop was in 1949. So that would make sundrop a copy as well :D

[ 02-24-2006, 06:00 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

Mr Nethead
02-24-2006, 07:05 PM
Actually, Sun Drop was invented in 1928.

http://www.sundrop.net/history.php

So it came about 20 years before Mountain Dew.

ramonazo
02-24-2006, 07:07 PM
Whoa :eek: , I left several hours the board and look at all this controversial talk!

IMO, I agree with iluvsurge and Mello Yello Luver, Pepsi always bashes Coke on their commercials, AND I'M GETTING TIRED OF THAT! that the truckers, that the monkey, that the little girl that jells a man because there's only Coke in the restaurant (when I saw that ad I wanted to grab that girl and slap her on her face!!! :mad: )... In the history of Pepsi, maybe there's more than one hundred ads where Pepsi brands harasses Coke brands... in conclusion, I'm enough of Pepsi commercials harassing Coke. :mad:

the saint
02-24-2006, 07:07 PM
thanks Zabe, at least someone else on here besides myself see the "win regardless of the cost" way of life for corporations in the world we live in.

This is like everyones beloved Coca Cola filing lawsuits in the first part of last century against every company that used the word "cola" it was an attempt to bankrupt them out of business so that they "the good guys" (as you all seem to see them) could be the only one around instead of the leader. That doesn't much promote "taking the highroad and welcoming innovation and competition" now does it?

the saint
02-24-2006, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by Mr Nethead:
Actually, Sun Drop was invented in 1928.

http://www.sundrop.net/history.php

So it came about 20 years before Mountain Dew. Perhaps you should look at this page http://www.dpsu.com/sundrop.html
the drink wasn't invented until 1949 unless I am missing something or reading the company info page wrong. If so, please tell me so

I may be reading this wrong as well but if the hillbilly drawings were on the bottles in 1948 then the drink was around in 1948 as you can read here: http://mountaindew.com/about_dew/history/history02.php

[ 02-24-2006, 10:12 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

Mr Nethead
02-24-2006, 07:20 PM
Check this out.

http://www.dpsu.com/brands_sundrop.html

Now I'm confused. We've got conflicting reports here. lol

[ 02-24-2006, 06:31 PM: Message edited by: Mr Nethead ]

ramonazo
02-24-2006, 07:32 PM
There's also www.sundrop.com, (http://www.sundrop.com,) but there they don't say anything about the origin of the brand

[ 02-24-2006, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: Ramón Coca-Colero ]

the saint
02-24-2006, 11:14 PM
Now see if I am wrong it was the information I was going on and not me pulling something out of the crack of my well you know, hehe :D . Maybe someone might could find out for certain, like maybe someone that is from sundrop country whoever that may be.

golee1
02-24-2006, 11:30 PM
Originally posted by the saint:


It is all about winning, doesn't matter what it is in. Business, racing, football, baseball whatever you strive to be number one, PERIOD.
The thing is though if you crush the competition early on you don't have to worry about it knocking you off of your perch later. I never thought I'd be quoting Ray Kroc, but I was reminded of something he said:
"This is rat eat rat, dog eat dog. I'll kill 'em, and I'm going to kill 'em before they kill me."

That about sums it up.

the saint
02-24-2006, 11:57 PM
How about the one from I don't remember if it was patton or macarthur "the idea is not to die for your country but to make the other son-of-a-bit*h die for his" or to that effect I do not have it right here in front of me at this time.

Then again ray kroc could have meant he will kill them and then grill them. HEHE :D

[ 02-24-2006, 10:58 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

iluvsurge220
02-25-2006, 02:15 AM
Yeah The Saint, all that stuff you said about school and baseball I understand. I have received F's on homework assignments and schoolwork before. Just like you I have never got anything lower than a B on a report card or anything. I did get a C once but it was a weighted (advanced) class so your final grade is actually a letter grade higher so I really got a B. I have never not been picked for a baseball team, but I did get cut when I tried out for my middle school basketball team so I know what it feels like not to be good enough. I have worked hard for this though. It wasn't like I could just show up and have good grades given to me. Yes I agree with you that in today's society, anyone will do whatever it takes to win. They will do anything at any cost, so I understand why Pepsi is doing what it is doing to try and limit the sales of Vault. All I want is for people to understand that Mountain Dew does have decent competition now. Like they all say, "Records are meant to be broken." Im not saying that Vault is going to surpass Mountain Dew in sales because Im sure it wont. I mean that Mountain Dew sales will probably drop off somewhat due to good sales of Vault. Maybe Mountain Dew won't be on top forever. Sorry for sounding like a jerk earlier. I really don't get mad at all ever and I am a really calm person. There is just one more thing. When you said "I understand you are only 19 and Im not bashing you about your age... but you seriously have a lot of growing up and seeing the world for what it is...". At first I took it as you were calling me immature which in a way I am because I am probably quite a bit younger than you, but I took it as you meaning it in a bad way. I figure that you probably didnt mean it that way and you just meant that I haven't seen the world and the way it works for as long as you have so you know it better than I do. I am a very mature person for my age. There is really no way of proving that to you, but if you knew me better I think you would understand. I think I am a smart young man and honestly pretty wise for my age. I've been around very smart and wise great grandparents, grandparents, and parents my whole lives, and they brought me up to be a bright, intelligent, and mature person. I greatly appreciate them all for doing that and I have learned a great deal from them. Anyways, I just wanted to know what you meant by that. Well, I think I am gonna post this. This has been a crazy discussion. LOL!!!

01GTB
02-25-2006, 02:28 AM
For the saint :D

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/mp3clips/newmoviespeeches/moviespeechpatton.mp3

Mr Zabe
02-25-2006, 05:08 AM
Sign me up!

SURGE
02-25-2006, 05:27 AM
Originally posted by the saint:
"Dislaimer: This statement was written in haste after I saw the announcement so if I come off too harsh my appologies:"
What kind of crap is this?? If you don't like your post hit the edit and delete it. You want to bash something but don't want to get called on it is what I think. Wow that was a whopper really. First off as anybody who has been on the board as long as you have I would hope that you have seen my wide range of critisms for Coke as well as Pepsi. Infact I would say that excluding Vault I only prefer Coke stuff about 60-65% of the time. SoBe is great, Gatorade has been a money maker, Diet Pepsi is a solid diet and the list goes on (dozens). Bash me all you want for being biased but look at my record and you will see that while I hold a strong opinion about some things I'm not uninformed. You wanna troll and missrespresent me fine but don't expect me not to point out that unlike you I'm not a paid yes-man working for the very company that I claim I'm unbiasdly commenting on. Not to say that working for Pepsi or Coke makes you biased but its obvious from your tone that you would rather attack me because I'm not a 100% Pepsi only kinda guy. Grow up man I don't hate you or your product so calm down and have a nice day. ;)

the saint
02-25-2006, 11:00 AM
Maybe you should do a search of your posts and actually read anything that you have said good regarding ANY Pepsi product. If you happen to find one go ahead and post it here, I couldn't.

[ 02-25-2006, 03:38 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

SURGE
02-25-2006, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by the saint:
Maybe you should do a search of your posts and actually read anything that you have said good regarding ANY Pepsi product. If you happen to find one go ahead and post it here, I couldn't. http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=001075;p=1#0000 00

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=002155;p=1#0000 00

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=003319;p=1#0000 02

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000473#000039

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=002371#000001

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=000174#000003

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=002244#000020

http://www.bevnet.com/bevboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=003537#000016

What now?


There are lots more and quite a few on Vaultkicks and SaveSURGE but you gotta register to see those. Needless to say you obviously need training on the search function- some of those are even recent. I have always thought Pepsi gets their product out better, has better product logos, and has some really great products here and there. I like how Pepsi is willing to do lots of seasonal sodas as well (like Spice). So before you start making me look like a tool do alittle research and admit when you're wrong.

On the whole MDX vs. VAULT as an energy drink thing I hate to break it to you but I wrote an editorial on Vaultkicks aa well as comments on here about how I feel that callign VAULT an EG is unfair- I agree with you, I always have, way ahead of you buddy. But when you say that Pepsi isnt pushing MDX as the anti-Vault well thats just silly0 it came out after VAULT was tested but before the national rollout, its sinage is similar as is its marketining and use of a unqiue bottle. Get a clue man Pepsi wanted MDX to steal Vault's steam. In the end it will be Vault vs. Dew but only because MDX has become deadweight on the shelves due only to Pepsi's missmanagedment of the brand. I have always complemented Pepsi for very solid rollouts of new product but MDX is not one of them.

[ 02-26-2006, 01:03 AM: Message edited by: SURGE ]

pepsidew
02-25-2006, 09:12 PM
i thought vault didn't have any so called energy drink ingrediants??? if it doesnt then how could it be compared to MDX?

iluvsurge220
02-26-2006, 12:08 AM
Well they just say it has so much caffeine in it that it can be called an energy drink. Honestly, I don't see how this is so. It just tastes like normal pop to me.

karks88
02-26-2006, 01:09 AM
This whole thing just gets out of hand from time to time but in a way it's fun to have a rivalry. I personally don't have a problem with Dew trying to bash Vault, but I like to get the community stirred up smile.gif I like seeing Vault fans get up and take pride in their drink, of which they are doing a terrific job!

I guess I'd probably be mad about it if I were a billionaire CEO but since I'm just a guy scraping by with a normal job I say let them beat each other up! In most every corporate and political campaign all morals are thrown out the window.

While I have no problem with Pepsi trying to defend themselves, I do think their ads are getting very tired. I mean the whole Jackie Chan stuff is just uncreative and a waste of money. There was a time when their ads were really well done but I think they've hit a bit of a slump.

SURGE
02-26-2006, 02:02 AM
I hope I don't come off as a jerk in this convo but at the same time I hope yall understand that I won't let some guy sit on here and critisize my record like I'm some sorta paid shill. Everybody who has been here for years knows that while I prefer Coke I'm not one to let them off too easily. I'm simply an unpaid soda follower and if some people wanna go after me fine. But know that I won't take some pawn telling me what I do and don't believe. I'm not a Pepsi or Coke or DPSU guy I support whatever is better and right now Coke is #1 with DPSU close behind and Pepsi is a distant third though admittedly they have some real great stuff out now as well as coming soon.

SURGE
02-26-2006, 02:09 AM
Originally posted by pepsidew:
i thought vault didn't have any so called energy drink ingrediants??? if it doesnt then how could it be compared to MDX? seriously read my post *I admit that* Vault is no energy drink, I have said that forever contrary to KO's ads. Sure they Jolt-like 72mgs of caffine is the best on the market but VAULT has no energy drink like ingredients. I have already stated this in my post, on VAULTkicks.org (#1 VAULT site on the internet), as well as many other places. Even though MDX and VAULT are not both similar they are marketed to the same crowd. Heck even the MDX signage contains a slightly different version of the "drinks like a soda kicks like an energy drink" tagline, something along the lines of "tastes like a soda, drinks like an energydrink" if that isnt just a paraphrasing of the VAULT trademark I don't know what is. I hate to be a jerk (again) but read my post I agree with you and I always have-

the saint
02-26-2006, 02:01 PM
The quotes are your actual posts. I have made a few notations on them and evidently your saying something good and mine isn't the same. Product would actually mean what is inside the bottle, not on the label, not what you can win. I have also noted that you seemed to enjoy Josta, It is the one, well three actual good reviews of a product lited in your reply.
11-24-2001
"I tired Pepsi's new energy drink AMP today and found it to be just "another" energy drink. I wasnt as bad as Red Bull but it wasnt remarkably good. If Pepsi doesnt watchout they are gonna destory the Mt. Dew brand name. It beats KMX from Coke so I suppose Pepsi has the upperhand but I've tried better energy drinks."
This isn't really a good review, it's kinda like when your mother-in-law burns the steaks and you have to pour 1/2 bottle of A-1 on it to be able to eat it, and when she asks you say "It was really tasty"

10-28-2003
You enjoyed a promotion that Pepsi had giving away songs from I Tunes, but ,this is what you posted:
"Too bad the brands that the caps are included on arn't better."

11-07-2005
You posted that you thought the idea of glass bottled Pepsi was "Classy" doesn't say anything about the actual product just the container. I guess I will give you this one.

9-22-2001

You miss Josta and Crystal Pepsi, I assume that means a good review of a product so I will give you this one as well.

5-11-2004
You said Josta was a great product, that you missed 2-1/2 years earlier, This is actually saying something good about a Pepsi product.

6-22-2003
"JOSTA ROCKED" okay another (third Josta oriented that you found) not bashing a Pepsi product.

3-07-2004
"Man Storm was good stuff" second actual good thing you said about a pepsi product

02-03-2006
"Way better logo. Storm was a pretty cool concept too." Is the sierra mist logo being better saying something good about the product that Shasta is inquiring about or do you classify "a cool concept" as a good review of a product?

Oh and I do not go to savesurge or vaultkicks, I do not see the point in joining since one is a dead and long gone soda and the other.. well we shall see I guess.

[ 02-26-2006, 01:04 PM: Message edited by: the saint ]

the saint
02-26-2006, 02:21 PM
I do not need training in the search function by the way. I am fully capable of using the function. I do however have better things to do than look thru your 1000 plus posts for the 3 good things you said about Josta.
For the record I "HAVE" been here for years and I do know that you prefer coke, it is apparent in the constant bashing of any Pepsi product, well except for Josta. I am not a "yes-man" as you claim, nor a troll,nor your buddy, nor a pawn. I find it amusing that you would tell me to grow up. when you resort to name calling like a child.

mjb1124
02-26-2006, 04:29 PM
It appears that this thread has basically become a pissing contest between two people. So let's lock this one in the Vault. :D

[ 02-26-2006, 03:29 PM: Message edited by: mikibacsi1124 ]

Mr Nethead
02-26-2006, 05:28 PM
Us soda fanatics... we're so passionate. lol

Mr Zabe
02-26-2006, 05:37 PM
White flag waving in the wind. smile.gif
"Can't we all get along" said my great great uncle Mr Over Filled Zabe. LOL (He drowned in big old vat of butter milk while milking his goats.LOL)

[ 02-26-2006, 04:38 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

Tons O' Fun
02-26-2006, 05:46 PM
Vault is Good. That is a given. MDX is Good that is also a given. You can like one. you can like both, you can like neither. But in the end it really doesnt matter. It is like Ford Vs. Chevy sure they are alike but they have huge differences but you can like them both or you could like Suzuki or another brand. People with a life wont judge you on what type of soda you like. Get over it.

pepsidew
02-26-2006, 06:19 PM
Originally posted by Tons O' Fun:
Vault is Good. That is a given. MDX is Good that is also a given. You can like one. you can like both, you can like neither. But in the end it really doesnt matter. It is like Ford Vs. Chevy sure they are alike but they have huge differences but you can like them both or you could like Suzuki or another brand. People with a life wont judge you on what type of soda you like. Get over it. :D

great post - this thread is now over. move on people

iluvsurge220
02-26-2006, 07:01 PM
Yes, now that it's been a few days I kind of feel silly for arguing about this. Sure I'd love to see Vault do very well, but the only thing I can do about that is buy it and buy it and buy more of it. Talkin about it on here isn't gonna do anything for it.

SURGE
02-27-2006, 03:01 AM
Originally posted by iluvsurge220:
Yes, now that it's been a few days I kind of feel silly for arguing about this.I'm with ya on that. Like I have always pointed out Vault (and MDX) serve only to create more competition which benefits us all. The effects of these benefits can be seen already. Vault is availible- thanks to SURGE fans everywhere- and with that comes price cuts not only for VAULT drinkers but for Dew people as well.

In the end I suppose its best to brush off attacks and reflect on the fact that were it not for the spirit of SURGE fans, there would be no VAULT. Vault/SURGE have dedication as their number-one asset. A few years back when I got on here everybody told me to give up, and I know that many others were in the same position. Still had we listened to them we wouldn't be here today. I seriously doubt any soda (excluding TaB) has, or likely ever will have such a great community-

Mr Zabe
02-27-2006, 08:44 AM
Just my two cents. smile.gif

I believe when the loyal drinkers of Coke's (original formula)revolted to the point of war over replacing Coke II and killing off regular coke;that was the most outrage I have ever seen over a soda pop. Whether Coca Cola was playing games or not,the public outrage was covered in the media daily.

IMO Coke Classic (original and HFCS) drinkers have proven to be the most loyal soda pop consumers.

[ 02-27-2006, 07:49 AM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

Hollow Man
02-27-2006, 11:51 AM
I would argue that SURGE fans were/are just as loyal as Coke drinkers, they just happen to be much smaller in numbers.

-HM

karks88
02-27-2006, 02:53 PM
We take it to the streets like no one else smile.gif

DMC
02-27-2006, 11:29 PM
It is funny reading your posts, you bash Pepsi for knocking at cokes lame attempt it's not a lame attempt, it's a great attempt by Coca-Cola. it's a quality tasting product, and they are marketing it extremely well. Coca-Cola has the overall market with Coca-Cola vs. Pepsi, they own the market in the diet category, and Sprite slaughters Sierra Mist and 7up. the only thing coca-cola is getting their ass kicked with, is mountain dew, and they are simply trying to get a good, quality, well received product out there to compete with mountain dew.

will it work? who knows, i think in 5 months or so, we'll find out if vault can be a decent competitor for mountain dew. i think it can. i think it will succeed, and succeed well. do i see it topping dew? no. anytime down the future? improbable, but possible.

like you said in your post, if vault takes %1 from mountain dew sales, that's $20,000,000 pepsi will not be getting in dew sales, and $20,000,000 CCE will be getting in Vault sales. i don't see that being "lame".

golee1
02-27-2006, 11:34 PM
[QUOTE]

will it work? who knows, i think in 5 months or so, we'll find out if vault can be a decent competitor for mountain dew. i think it can. i think it will succeed, and succeed well. do i see it topping dew? no. anytime down the future? improbable, but possible.I doubt it'll overtake dew either, but who knows. 40 years ago who woulda thought Sprite could overtake 7-up.

CStoreCatMan
03-30-2006, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by DMC:
[QUOTE]the only thing coca-cola is getting their ass kicked with, is mountain dew, and they are simply trying to get a good, quality, well received product out there to compete with mountain dew.Yes and no. Coca-cola is also getting their @#! kicked by Pepsi in the non carb category...in a BIG way. But your point on dew and vault is valid.

Mr Zabe
03-30-2006, 03:54 PM
Yes and no. Coca-cola is also getting their @#! kicked by Pepsi in the non carb category.. Maybe I'm missing something. Please explain this with an example or two. Tks

[ 03-30-2006, 01:54 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

Hollow Man
03-30-2006, 03:56 PM
I assume he's speaking about Gatorade.

-HM

Mr Zabe
03-30-2006, 04:02 PM
Ok...I was thinking non carb meant "non carbohydrate" not "non carbonation". Oh well it's that the Tomato/Tomata delima. LOL

CStoreCatMan
03-30-2006, 05:38 PM
[/QUOTE]Maybe I'm missing something. Please explain this with an example or two. Tks [/QB][/QUOTE]

First, I'm talking about what's commonly referred to as non-carbs, new age, etc. Basically, anything that's not a soft drink.

Let's look at some examples...

Pepsi has Frappuccino (HUGE brand)...Coke has nothing competitive.

Pepsi has Sobe (BIG brand)...Coke has nothing competitive.

Gatorade vs. Powerade...no contest.

Energy also varies by market...Rockstar was a good addition...but we all know that Coke's eggs will go into the Full Throttle and Tab baskets.

Water sales can vary by area...not sure what national numbers show...in my market Aquafina outsells Dasani more than 3 to 1.

So anyways, there are a few off the top of my head.

pepsidew
03-30-2006, 06:20 PM
yep - Frappuccino, Sobe, Gatorade, Aquafina, and Lipton. i'm not sure about Dole Juices. as for the energy drinks i'm not really sure...around here i think they are pretty close

karks88
03-31-2006, 06:27 PM
Pepsi has done a great job in going beyond just CSDs. Even as those CSD sales drop for both companies, Pepsi is fortunate to have the other stuff to lean on for growth. Coke seems like they are really just getting started with products outside the category.

mr jones
04-01-2006, 06:34 PM
Coke has always been about its CSD's. They've made several attempts in the past to crack some of the non carb categories (half a$$ed I might add), but quite unsuccessfully outside of MM juice and Powerade. Dasani sells ok...

Pepsi(Co) made some very smart moves back in the 90's to partner with Frappuccino & Lipton and later buy Quaker and Sobe. Aquafina took off pretty well for Pepsi at the millenium...

Soon, they will be able to carry Gatorade on Pepsi's trucks, from PBG bottlers, Coke: watch out for what's going to be a beverage GIANT when that happens!