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View Full Version : why doesn't coke just take the "classic" out of coke?



Empire State Buddy
06-07-2005, 08:12 AM
it just seems unnecessary. everyone KNOWS that it's old coke now (well, for the most part). it just seems like a reminder of the "new" coke debacle. why not move on?

the saint
06-07-2005, 10:34 AM
from what I remember it had to do with a patent or a copyright something of that nature. I would think that after 20 years though they would drop the classic.

[ 06-07-2005, 09:43 AM: Message edited by: the saint ]

Empire State Buddy
06-07-2005, 02:10 PM
yeah...

or maybe because the "new" coke thing was such a disaster... they don't want to even think about changing the name. LOL.

[ 06-07-2005, 01:26 PM: Message edited by: Empire State Buddy ]

Mr Zabe
06-07-2005, 04:48 PM
The use of the word "Classic" was used to reassure millions of Coke drinkers across the world that the MotherShip of all soft drinks would never,ever again be reformulated.

Classic by definition: Serving as the established model or standard:

A classic does not change, a classic is in itself is a pure form of all objects in it's subgroup.

I highly doubt that Classic Coke will ever change from what it was in the past and what it is today.

Classic Coke is the gold standard for the carbonated soda pop industry....Royalty.

Zabe

[ 06-07-2005, 05:52 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

Empire State Buddy
06-07-2005, 05:51 PM
(bowing) LOL. smile.gif

BottleBoss
06-07-2005, 06:54 PM
To differentiate (sp) it from all the brand extensions probably.

XLS_04
06-07-2005, 10:44 PM
they should remove the word classic, nobody even calls it Coca-Cola classic anyway. some things Coke is afraid to change, some things they change too soon.

Hacksaw
06-07-2005, 11:22 PM
Well, they did switch from sugar to HFCS.

But, "Classic" is probably not needed in areas without Coke II.

The Interpreter
06-07-2005, 11:42 PM
To my knowledge, Coke II is basically kaput.

Empire State Buddy
06-07-2005, 11:53 PM
do they still sell coke 2? LOL.

i remember seeing it once or twice when i lived in ohio... many years ago. i figured it was "new" coke at the time, but wasn't sure.

but, basically, i think they keep the "classic" because they're afraid to change it... afraid people will get confused and think, "oh no! new coke is back!"

of course, they could always just keep making the "classic" a smaller and smaller font... until, finally, it disappears! LOL.

Look In The Tunk
06-08-2005, 12:27 AM
Originally posted by Empire State Buddy:
do they still sell coke 2? LOL.

. Unless you're in the Marshall Islands (or somewhere in the area, right?) . That's the only place that has it now.

Empire State Buddy
06-08-2005, 07:19 AM
when i was a kid, i actually liked "new" coke better than "classic." but... my tastes have changed as i've gotten older and am pretty sure i'd like classic better now, just because it has a stronger taste to it.

boodoo
06-08-2005, 08:37 AM
Coca-Cola must be sweetened with sugar, Classic Coke can be sweetened with "other than sugar".

The Interpreter
06-08-2005, 09:03 AM
Coke can only be sweetened with sugar? Not true. Not even close to true. Where did you get this idea?

[ 06-08-2005, 08:05 AM: Message edited by: The Interpreter ]

Mr Zabe
06-08-2005, 11:51 AM
FYI
In the United States, Coke does NOT produce nor market a carbonated soft drink with pure sugar cain.

In a few other countries, like Mexico Coke sells a Classic Coke that is sweetened with only sugar cain. If your community has a Mexican Grocery Store, chances are they have Mexican Coke. The bottle is the old bottle with a metal cap. It's a very tasty treat.

Empire State Buddy
06-08-2005, 12:21 PM
Originally posted by The Interpreter:
Coke can only be sweetened with sugar? Not true. Not even close to true. Where did you get this idea? it's my understanding that coke made the switch to corn sweetener before it switched to "new" coke (or back to "classic"). though... a lot of people think that the whole "new" coke thing was a "conspiracy" to mask the switch. but... if the "switch" already happened... then there's no need for a "conspiracy." LOL. smile.gif

Mr Zabe
06-08-2005, 12:46 PM
LOL
Many moon's ago and many times over and over again,the original coke (classic minus the coco leaves) was sweetened with sugar.

Please all you long time coke drinkers, was it in the late 60's or early 70's that coke adjusted the the formula to add corn sweetener and or reduce sugar cain completely from it's recipe?

FYI.... Classic Coke had long changed to corn sweetener when Coke II was introduced. Coke II failed because it had a syrupy sugary taste that regular Pepsi possed.

Coke drinkers wanted the old sweet but "knock your socks off" one two punch that "classic" coke had pleased it's drinkers through the years.

[ 06-08-2005, 11:47 AM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]

Android
06-08-2005, 01:15 PM
Actually from what I've read, it wasn't til the late 70s that high fructose corn syrup was developed enough so that it tasted "good enough" to be used for sodas.

It was around 1978 that Coke and Pepsi both allowed their non-cola products to use HFCS (corn syrup), and in 1980 Coke started blending HFCS with sugar. It was 1983 when Pepsi started letting their bottlers go 50/50 with HFCS. From there they both increased the level of HFCS over the next couple of years until real sugar was gone.

andy

Empire State Buddy
06-08-2005, 02:27 PM
right. but it had nothing to do with the name change... or invention of "new" coke. there was no "conspiracy."

"new" coke was simply A BIG MISTAKE! LOL.

at least, in the short term. in the long-term, i think it solidified coke (classic)'s fan base. after all, it's 20 years later, and coke is still #1 by a sizeable margin.

keith1024
06-13-2005, 01:31 AM
Some people, usually older, actually look for the "classic" on the package. They want to be sure that they are not getting something else(new coke, coke w/lime, etc.). The mistake that new coke was still haunts Coca-Cola.

Empire State Buddy
06-13-2005, 08:31 AM
i guess the fact that it said "new" on it... didn't tip them off... LOL.

The Interpreter
06-13-2005, 08:51 AM
It didn't, though.

Older folk find the classic part to be an endorsement or certification by Coke that it truly is "The Real Thing, Coke is."

DJ HawaiianShirt
06-13-2005, 09:18 AM
Well, I've heard that even though Coke switched to HFCS before the introduction of New Coke, sales started to dwindle because of the (obvious) inferiority of HFCS as compared to sugar.

So, the conspiracy is not that they introduced New Coke to mask the HFCS switch-over, but rather to re-energize sales that probably weakened BECAUSE of the switch.

But c'mon, do you really think they would do such a suicidal move just to do this? Coke lost ridiculous amounts of money from the New Coke venture...

I find it hard to believe...

Empire State Buddy
06-14-2005, 12:13 AM
you think coke would've just tried changing their advertising and marketing for coke... instead of changing the formula. of course, clearly they didn't know what a disaster it would be, but... i think they could've forsaw some "complaints."

they also just could've released a separate cola drink aimed at younger people... called "coke 2." like they did after the fact.

either way, classic ended up gaining market share afterwards, right? i mean, after a few years.

cstu
06-30-2005, 04:57 PM
This site claims that it wasn't a marketing scheme:
http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/newcoke.asp

However, it goes on to say this:

An interesting little claim sprang up in the wake of the introduction of Classic Coke, one having to do with its sweetener. People swore they detected a change in the flavor between Classic Coke and the original. This gave rise to the rumor that the product had been reformulated, dropping cane sugar in favor of high fructose corn syrup. Depending upon whom you listened to, either the demand for the return of original Coca-Cola afforded the company the opportunity to switch from cane sugar to corn syrup or the whole fiasco of taking original Coca-Cola off the shelves and reintroducing it three months later as Classic Coke was all a brilliant scheme to mask the change in sweetener. According to whispered wisdom, the company had hoped to slip the modification past consumers by having it take place during the original beverage's absence from the shelves. People would be so darned glad to have Classic Coke back that they wouldn't notice it didn't taste the same as original Coca-Cola. (Another twist to this rumor had it that New Coke had deliberately been formulated to taste awful in order to facilitate the switch — this supposedly gave Coca-Cola an excuse for pulling the original formula and then putting it back on the market after a brief absence, making it look all along as if they were simply responding to consumer demands.)

The change in sweetener wasn't anything that diabolical. Corn syrup was cheaper than cane sugar; that's what it came down to. In 1980, five years before the introduction of New Coke, half the cane sugar in Coca-Cola had been replaced with high fructose corn syrup. By six months prior to New Coke's knocking the original Coca-Cola off the shelves, there was no cane sugar in American Coca-Cola. Whether they knew it or not, what consumers were drinking then was 100% sweetened by high fructose corn syrup.

cstu
06-30-2005, 05:00 PM
Personally, I think there's little question that Coke realized that people didn't like HFCS instead of sugar so they came up with the brilliant idea of switching to something much worse tasting than Coke w/HFCS - New Coke.

Then everyone cried out how much they missed "real" Coke and Coke laughed all the way to the bank.

cstu
06-30-2005, 05:03 PM
Anyway, when is there going to be a backlash against HFCS? The crap is terrible for you (your brain doesn't recognize it as sugar and you still remain hungry).

riot
07-01-2005, 02:20 AM
sorry. but i don't buy the "conspiracy theories" about new Coke. it was simply a HUGE mistake.

they were losing market share to pepsi... because of pricing and b/c pepsi had years of better advertising (i.e. the pepsi challenge, and michael jackson/"choice of a new generation").

why they just didn't come out with better ads is beyond me. changing the "secret formula" just seems dumb (in hindsight).

the ironic thing is that... coke's big mistake (new coke) actually made people fall in love with coke classic all over again.

it wasn't a conspiracy though. they just got really, REALLY... lucky (in my opinion).

[ 07-01-2005, 01:20 AM: Message edited by: riot ]

Markito
07-01-2005, 03:51 AM
really, REALLY... UNlucky
and then really, REALLY... lucky

riot
07-01-2005, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by Markito:
really, REALLY... UNlucky
and then really, REALLY... lucky yep. smile.gif

boodoo
07-01-2005, 08:50 AM
Interpreter,

I don't claim to be an expert on Coca-Cola sweeteners and my evidence is anecdotal. I was working for a Coke distributor before and after the Coca-Cola / New Coke switch. For those who didn't live it I can tell you it was the biggest blast in the history of this industry.

Once New Coke was launched my customers and I noticed that the Coca-Cola they had in their stores said it was sweetened with sugar and the New Coke I delivered was sweetened with corn syrup.

When the boys in Atlanta said "uncle" and released Classic Coke my distributor dropped New Coke like a hot potato. The Classic was sweetened with corn syrup as it is today.

DJ HawaiianShirt
07-01-2005, 09:04 AM
riot is BACK ;)

Beverage Slinger
07-01-2005, 08:03 PM
Hey boodoo,I was there too,it was a hell of a campaign,I remember watching all the coke people worked up in in a frenzy,there was hooting and hollerin,they were getting in everyones faces,especially the pepsi reps,it was a bag fest and it was fun,if I remember right some of my coke buddies told me they were having a huge co. BBQ and they were giving everybody the next day off,that they had beaten pepsi with new CokeII and they would dominate the cola market,time passed,smiles turned upside down,pepsi smelling blood in the water,aggressivly hit them hard with ads and pricing,I think it was a come on over and try pepsi campaign,it went over so well that the people at pepsi had a huge BBQ and gave everybody the next day off,not long after that was the release of Classic Coke.Man it was a fun time.

riot
07-02-2005, 03:06 AM
i heard that pepsi was going to release something called "Savana Cola," which was supposed to taste like Coca-Cola Classic, and THAT'S why Coke rushed Classic to the market.

Can you imagine if Pepsi had re-introduced Classic/Savana... before Coke?!? :eek: What a train wreck that would've been! LOL.

Either way... we all know what happened after (new Coke). And it may always be a mystery WHY and HOW the whole thing started in the beginning.

Still, Coke (Classic) has held onto it's lead ever since. So, I guess the whole thing worked out okay for the Coca-Cola Company.

And, it'd be a real coup if diet coke overtook pepsi in the near future; but, with so many versions, it's unlikely to happen now.

But i can just imagine the commercials... "Guess who's #2? Yep. More people reach for Diet Coke, than for Pepsi... everyday!" LOL. Trust me, coke wouldn't be above rubbing pepsi's nose in it. they've been waiting for sooo long. LOL

SamC
07-02-2005, 08:25 AM
The Coke/New "Coke" fiasco had nothing to do with covering a switch to HFCS, was not a briliant marketing gimmick designed to get people to realize how much they loved Coke, was not a plot, nor any of the other varrious urban legends that float about.

It has to do, as with everyting in RG's sad reign at KO, with M O N E Y .

KO and its bottlers (and there was thousands back then, this is long before CCE and CCBCC and so on), operated under a 1920 court settlement. KO was required to sell "Coca-Cola syrup" to the bottlers for a price determined by applying a math formula to the wholesale price of sugar.

Fine. When, over the years, KO wanted to launch new products, like Sprite, Fanta, and Tab, it reached new agreements with the bottlers to cover these. Agreements more favorable to KO. KO made more money selling other syrups than it did Coca-Cola syrup.

So then came Diet Coke. KO said that Diet Coke was not "Coca-Cola" and bottlers had to buy it under its Tab contract. At a much higher price than the bottlers were paying for Coca-Cola. Bottlers say, of course, Diet Coke is "Coca-Cola", it says so right on the package.

So off to court we go.

While the case was pending, Coca-Cola launches the New "Coke" Fiasco. Which was designed to fail from day one. Then it launches "Coca-Cola Classic". But, guess what, KO says "Coca-Cola Classic" is NOT made from Coca-Cola syrup covered under the 1920 contracts, but from Coca-Cola Classic syrup, and wants the bottlers to pay big $$ for it. Of course, KO will say the bottlers all of the Coca-Cola syrup it wants. Coca-Cola syrup is the stuff used to make New "Coke", which, of course, nobody wants.

It was called the "Alice in Wonderland" argument, "Coca-Cola syrup is whatever I say it is".

Eventually, the courts reached a split decision. Diet Coke syrup was not Coca-Cola syrup and KO could charge whatever it wanted for it. But both real Coca-Cola and New "Coke" syrup were Coca-Cola syrup and had to be sold under the 1920 contract.

KO then worked it out with its bottlers, and killed the new product. The whole thing was just designed to allow KO to rename Coca-Cola as something else, so it could charge extra for it.

boodoo
07-02-2005, 10:55 AM
Great info SamC!

After all is said and done it is just like grandma said to lil'boodoo on the back porch a long time ago...follow the money!

Dr. Galaga
07-02-2005, 11:15 AM
I don't buy the HFCS switch thing. Coke (and Pepsi) were slowly mixing in more HFCS and less sugar the whole time. It was a slow switch over.

The Interpreter
07-02-2005, 09:11 PM
SamC, if you are right, and I suspect you are, I wonder what Coca-Cola Zero syrup is! smile.gif

riot
07-03-2005, 12:18 AM
regarding what SamC just explained...

hmm.

i mean. it's as believable as any of the other explanations.

but, basically, whatever "theory" one chooses to believe, in the end... coca-cola simply... uh... well... screwed things up... BIG TIME. LOL.