View Full Version : CC Contract Cancelled
04-10-2006, 07:12 PM
My local package distributor called me today and said he had received a letter from RBNA announcing the cancellation of RB's association with Creative Concepts. Anyone else heard anything?
Red Bull Vendor
04-10-2006, 07:21 PM
YES, RedBull North America called me today and said that all business with Creative Concepts has come to an end. so anyone out there please save your money and dont send CC a dime.
04-10-2006, 07:26 PM
any idea what the impact on us is? parts, warranty info, etc?
Red Bull Vendor
04-10-2006, 07:28 PM
Weel if you were dealing with CC, I would definately be reading over the contract with them very closely. My guess is from previous experience EVERYONE IS SCREWED, CC has your money and that is all they wanted. I tried calling today and got a machine, left a message and NO call back yet. But that doesnt suprise me. Thats CC's way of business
Red Sox fan
04-10-2006, 08:56 PM
wow, score one for my intuition!!
something about my phone conversations didn't sit right w/me. the guy I spoke with sounded EXACTLY like a used carsalesman. dead right on this one!
04-10-2006, 09:12 PM
Selling good used cars is noble.
Selling a vending program via a boiler room mentality is deplorable.
Red Bull Vendor
04-10-2006, 09:18 PM
Vending red bull is a great concept, just that CC gave it a bad reputation with all their lies and high expectations
Red Bull Vendor
04-10-2006, 10:18 PM
If anyone wants to get rid of their machines, I may be interested, send me a email and let me know what you want for them
04-10-2006, 10:49 PM
As long as you have a relationship with your local distributor you should be ok for product. Will Royal honor any warranty issues?
04-10-2006, 11:23 PM
Very good Q southbull...I spoke with royal today on that exact issue (I bought my machines used) before I read this thread, and I was turned to CC. Royal must have received word of the CC news...I wonder what the deal is. Anyone heard anything from RB? I will be calling them tomorrow.
04-10-2006, 11:57 PM
Thanks Entre. My focus is to maintain my accounts and continue to push product. I've already spent invested the $ for the machines- as far as I concerned my dealings with CC are done.
04-11-2006, 02:57 AM
I would agree in not dealing with CC, and am so glad I did not wind up purchasing the machines from them. But today I was told from Royal that Royal does not deal with warrenty issues, CC does. I spoke with CC today (before I read this post), and operator sent me to a voice mail- awaiting reply.
04-11-2006, 10:07 AM
Hey Lepke... what makes you the foremost expert on RB vending? i have no prior experience and i bought and successfully placed my machines myself... a lot of geniuses on here! as for RB no longer having anything to do with CC... the only issue is that of the warranty. if you already have your machines and a deal in place with a distributor, this essentially means nothing! i do, howevr, feel sorry for those who have paid for but have yet to recieve their machines... they may have a hell of a time recouping either.
04-11-2006, 10:37 AM
i just spoke with a high ranking contact i have in RBNA. he confirmed that YES they did terminate their relationship with CC. he assured me that RB will contact all of us soon and that they will work with royal to honor warranty contracts. this is good news seeing i have a 3 year warranty. (i worked the salesman into includung it) truthfully, i think this is a good thing! Lepke, do you think those people who are sucking wind with a loan to pay and 5 machines in their garage really want your opinion??? especially in light of current events?
04-11-2006, 10:46 AM
It's like that old saying "you can pay me now or you can pay me latter". I was one of those standing on the side lines with practically no vending experence,just about yelling Caution,Red Flag, Does Not Seem To Be Of Common Sense...to the newbie vending profit seekers waiting to toss big sums of money over the ships bow.
I do not see your point. This is a learning curve that some have had to learned the hard way. IMO An open forum at this point might just be therapeutic for all of us. As I have said before,this kind of thing makes me upset. I know that our board mates are good honest hard working people. Putting forth hard earned money in the hands of a less than forth coming company has to sting more than a 1000 pissed off bees.
[ 04-11-2006, 09:52 AM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]
04-11-2006, 10:48 AM
That's good news on the warranties Emaak - thanks for the update. I appreciate you posting what you know. If I learn anything new I will be sure to put it up here. Good luck everyone.
Originally posted by Lepke:
I firmly believe in entrepreneurship and I think people with no experience in a certain field can still succeeded in that field if they have what it takes. But from what Im seeing here in all these red bull vending threads, Im thinking that in the case of most of you people that you should have left it to the vending professionals.
Its obvious most of you have no idea what you are doing and are not savvy enough to figure it out. The last time I checked it was not a prerequisite to have a Masters in Business from Harvard to operate a vending machine company. In my opinion a vending machine company will be successful if the owner/operator is a) placing vending in the right spot b) pricing the product right to sell in his area c) places the right product in the machine and d)works his ass off.
All of which can be accomplished with little or no experience.
Just because some of these guys got hoodwinked by some shady franchisor doesn't mean they deserve to be talked down to. These guys were all trying to build a future for themselves.
I just received a call from Red Bull North America. They stated that they terminated their contract with CC on Saturday. He said Red Bull and Royal vending will honor the warrenty and that we should deal with our local distributor to purchase our product at the guaranteed price of $30 per case.
04-11-2006, 11:36 AM
i think everyone is making a bigger deal of this than need be. like i said before, if you already have your machines and deal with a distributor... what is the big deal?? RB is going to work with us and royal to ensure that the warranty is honored... some of you are acting like its the end of the world! i would, however, be curious to know if there is anyone out there who paid for, but has not yet recieved their machines? these people i feel sorry for. i actually got someone from CC on the phone a little while ago. she stubmled around a bit but then pretty much admitted that they were done... i couldn't get anyone on the phone to discuss the warranty. i left a message.
04-11-2006, 12:51 PM
to put some minds at ease.... i just got a call from CC. their customer service dept. assured me that although they no longer have a direct relationship with redbull, they will still be there for support and YES the warranty as well. they also said they are developing a new machine of their own. so if you've got money out there, it seems you will get something for it. to those of you who said you left a message and got no response; i really don't understand why... they called me back within an hour! like i've said previously... their salesman are pushy and resort to used car salesman type tactics, but it must be said that their support is solidly in tact. they've been honest with the money... and from my point of view thats most important! with that said, i'm going to give them the benifit of the doubt.
04-11-2006, 01:22 PM
My friend just my conservative opinion.
I do not arrive at the same conclusion that you did by reading what CC had said to you and by your own observation of their sale's force.
I will repeat what I have learned from getting burned a few times. Talk is cheap and one tends to hear what they want to hear. I see more than a few red flags with what CC has told you. Once again, IMO I would not continue doing business with them.
I hope you get some benefit because I have a whole lot of doubt that CC will preform in at least an ethical way. (No bad feeling here just my opinion based on doing deals on the rebound of a bad situation.)
[ 04-11-2006, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]
04-11-2006, 01:53 PM
you don't even own machines!! CC has already lived up to their end of the deal. at least where it concerns me. i'm sorry to rain on your parade of negativity, but i've got 4 machines out there doing pretty good... not to mention i got a great deal because i was in ground floor back in sept. i'm just looking out for those who are new. simply conveying what i know and what i learned. what confuses me is why someone with no vested interest would spend so much time posting negative nonsense and bad metaphores "sting of a 1000 bees" WHAT???
04-11-2006, 02:05 PM
I have a different writing style. LOL I have strong opinions as my family and extended family have been involved in many different kinds of businesses. I offer my gut level thoughts. Notice, I prefrece my posts with IMO.
I'm not negative as much as you might think. I say what's on my mind. If you do not agree than that's all good. At least we can speak our minds,no?
Like I have said, I am thrilled by your success. I say that with sincerity. I would like to think that we are on the same page. Remember I am a conservative. smile.gif
Gee if everyone agreed with me, then what would I have to learn? smile.gif
It's all good. OK
[ 04-11-2006, 01:20 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]
04-11-2006, 02:18 PM
what does politics have to do with vending redbull?? i'm a capitalist who votes republican, but side with the left on social issues.... that and 2 bucks will get me a can of redbull!!! i've been in business for myself since i was only 23 and things are moving along nicely... i'm in my mid 30's. sure i've been burned along the way. but thats part of the learning curve. bottom line.... CC did not screw me. (and i actually had dealings with them) therefore, i can not sit here and trash them. i posted a long message the other day on the wannabe thread. it explains beginning to end my experience with CC and the less than acceptable target marketing. again, when it comes to the money aspect of it, they've done no wrong. and yet again... i completely disagree with the way they approach sales. the 2 guys i had to deal with were like vultures, but i didn't let them rattle me. in the end i got what i wanted... 4 machines + 800 cans for $13710. + a 3 year warranty. they refunded me $1100 for the cans because the deal wasn't in place yet. also, they re-imbursed me $300 for the cost of moving the machines. now, why should i be skeptical or trash them?? they've done right by me!
04-13-2006, 01:14 PM
God do I feel lucky stumbling on this website last night. Yesterday, I sent in my payment to CC for 3 machines. As I was having a little "post purchase dissonance" I started to do more research on the net and found the vast array of negative remarks towards CC on this forum.
Needless to say, I called FedEx, had them cancel shipment, and even did a stop payment on my check. If it were not for you guys, I too, would have been another victim, so thank you.
I spoke with the sales person from CC this morning and told him the news. He actually had the audacity to tell me that they were going to be be completely closing out and not accepting any more purchase orders for my market by the end of this month.
Yeah, I believe that.
I think I'll use my nearly $15,000 somewhere else, or at least to purchase Red Bull machines at a fraction of their cost.
04-13-2006, 02:18 PM
We are looking for some more information on RBNA pulling the contract with CC. So far no calls to CC have been returned. RBNA said we have to pull our website down, which CC approved?? The site was not cheap so now what?
It seems like this could turn into a legal battle or at least turn ugly. Why on earth is CC being so tight lipped? When you call CC, they still have the same voice recording stating they are the Offical RED BULL vending company???
Any info would be fantastic....
If you're already a vendor, you should have been contacted by your local distributor and/or RBNA about the end of the contract with CC. CC no longer has a business relationship with RBNA effective 4/8/06. If you are an existing vendor, having gone through CC to establish your route, then basically the only thing that changes for you is that you now deal directly with your local distributor for product orders and new machine purchases, and all your maintenance/warranty issues are handled by Royal directly. If you're not already a distributor, and are looking to get involved in Red Bull vending, your only legitimate option at this point is to try to establish a relationship with your local distributor and try to get involved that way.
Part of the reason they pulled the plug was that RBNA wanted to be more involved directly with distributors and vendors and further develop those existing channels, rather than oversaturating the market by giving anyone who wants one a machine.
If you are considering sending CC money to start a route, don't. They are no longer authorized to do business on behalf of RBNA. I'm sorry to say, that if you're interested in starting a route now, you may have missed out. But, ultimately, it depends on your local distributor whether they allow you to purchase machines and develop a route. There is always the option of starting with some generics and offering RB for sale in those machines, but if you're looking to sell using the branded machines - your options are limited if you aren't already vending. My local distributor has already said he is interested in developing existing routes, and doesn't see adding any in the foreseeable future. I'm sure that many if not most distributors are approaching this the same way.
[ 04-13-2006, 03:35 PM: Message edited by: Veruca Vending ]
Originally posted by NShea:
If it were not for you guys, I too, would have been another victim, so thank you.
There aren't any victims here. Everyone who went through CC now enjoys the full support of local distribution and RBNA. If you didn't go through CC, chances are RBNA isn't even aware you exist.
A better way to look at it, is that we paied a higher premium to be among those who got in while CC held the door wide open. My price for product is the same, my price for new machines will be much reduced, and RBNA and my local vendor are now pro-actively involved in helping us maximize our potential with respect to our routes.
04-13-2006, 05:29 PM
Here is an email I received directly from a rep at Red Bull this morning:
Subject: Creative Concepts
Date: April 13, 2006 10:46:19 AM MDT
Thank you for contacting us.
Red Bull North America no longer has a formal buy-sell arrangement with Creative Concepts as of April 10, 2006.
Red Bull does not have a formal vending machine program at this time. However, if you have a vending company that is already established, please provide the name and address.
Red Bull North America
I have been doing some research on Red Bull Vending machines and I wanted to get the inside scoop on Creative Concepts of America, the supposed sole distributor of Red Bull vending machines.
I have heard they not longer have the sole contract to sell your machines. I have also heard several negative things about the company.
Bottom line, what are my options for purchasing your vending machines and operating them in my market.
I would greatly appreciate your feedback.
Future machine purchases for existing vendors is handled through our local distributor. The CC approach was unique, in that it was the first time these machines were available for sale to anyone. Red Bull purchased 100 of every 400 machines produced for their own use. Those machines were then available to local distributors on request to place at locations with the distributor servicing the machines. Red Bull actually owned the machines, and distributors had no access to purchasing or selling them. Now, with the end of their contract with CC, this is now approached very differently. Local distributors will handle the sale of machines to exisiting vendors, and Royal will directly handle warranty and maintenance issues. This is a new development, so our local distributor doesn't even have a price point on these yet, but RBNA assured me they would be substantially less to purchase than in going through CC, because they have essentially eliminated the middle man and any "operational" costs tacked on. In fact, they want to tightly control any future sale of the machines; they expressed to me that they would prefer I deal with purchasing used machines and/or selling machines through my local distributor before pursuing any other methods. One of the factors, I was told, in them deciding to pull the plug was the lack of control they saw over the sale of the machines - with them coming up for sale on eBay, etc. The program was never designed to flood the market with machines and vendors, which seemed to be happening with CC.
Bottom line is, if you are anxious to start vending Red Bull, you might be better off going with a generic and offering it for sale in a non-branded machine. If you're looking to buy the Royal units, you're going to have to go through your local distributor to get them, and that may not be an option for you if you aren't already an existing vendor. I'm almost certain that the reason they asked for your name and address, if you were an existing vendor, would be to match you up with Creative Concepts sale lists, or to get you in touch with your local distributor for product.
I am surprised that CC didn't disclose this in full when you contacted them. If they are still identifying themselves as authorized representatives of Red Bull, they are probably committing a crime. The bottom line is they blew it. But, there isn't any downside to this if you are an existing vendor, local distributor, or RBNA.
[ 04-13-2006, 05:02 PM: Message edited by: Veruca Vending ]
It might be a good idea for you to edit your email address out of the email you posted.
04-13-2006, 09:07 PM
I'm curious to find out what impact there will be for those that purchased Royal machines not through CC- is there a way to get "registered" with RBNA?
04-14-2006, 09:47 AM
Lepke... you sure do have a lot of time on your hands! at this point its safe to say, no one really cares for your opinions or thoughts. so why not just go away? there are plenty of threads here. some of which i'm sure suit whatever facet of the "beverage" business you're in. go someplace else. its clear no one here really wants to hear you rant about something you have no vested interest in! i'll tell you what... i have 4 machines placed in Jersey... you give me $20k, i'll sell you my route and then you could throw in your 2 cents. otherwise.... GO AWAY!!! you're a blowhard and obviously no one wants to read your bull**** anymore. i agree that perhaps your negativity and hostility come from shortcomings in other areas!! please... just SHUT UP!
04-14-2006, 10:27 AM
Speaking for myself, I would be thrilled if we could take a step back with some humility(you made need to Google for the meaning) and wish each other a healthy and Holy weekend of Passover and Easter.
We can agree to disagree with some respect. IMO
04-14-2006, 11:44 AM
My friend it take less energy IMO to love than it does to hate. I'm feeling lazy. smile.gif
I was running the soda pop fountain at the Camp David accords. I made some good money as Jimmy Carter gave me a great deal on a load of salted peanuts. LOL Those low priced peanuts kept those soda pop tabs sky high. LOL
04-14-2006, 11:57 AM
Arafat drank Sabra flavored Bubble Yum soda pop.
Barak drank Coca Cola glass.
Clinton drank Viagra body shots.
Did you know that in some parts Dr Pepper only comes in a bottle. ;)
[ 04-14-2006, 10:59 AM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]
04-14-2006, 12:26 PM
Not to offend anyone but,I am going to agree with Lepke on this issue. This is an "energy drink" section on beverage board. The posts as of lately have gotten out of hand. This board was meant for discussion of energy drinks, not "how much should I charge?" or "how many cans does my machine hold?". These questions would be better answered on a vending forum. Most of the people on this board are knowledgable on the beverages themselves, not in the intricates of vending machines. I myself, along with many others have some knowledge of machines but would not classify it as industy expertise.
While one person wants to "rant" about a veteran of this boards opinions and grammatical mistakes, not everyone feels this way. Just because you do not wish to hear his opinions does not make them any less valuable to someone else. Grammatical mistakes are what you fall back on when you do not have a valid argument on any thing else and feel that you must have the last word.
As far as telling others to leave, well we all for the most part got along quite well before your 2 weeks here and 17 posts. You really have no right telling people to leave just because you do not care for what they had to say. I know I am guilty of this as well, but the 2 people I have told this to were touting a sex inspired drink that more than likely NOONE outside of their company will more than likely ever see.
Bash me all you want, I have said it before and will say it again, I am not the one out $20,000 and have several machines with product getting closer to code everyday. I for one would like to wish you the best in your business endeavor, I hope you make a million bucks.
[ 04-14-2006, 11:27 AM: Message edited by: the saint ]
04-14-2006, 01:03 PM
" The SAINT wrote
Not to offend anyone but,I am going to agree with Lepke on this issue. This is an "energy drink" section on beverage board. The posts as of lately have gotten out of hand. This board was meant for discussion of energy drinks, not "how much should I charge?" or "how many cans does my machine hold?". These questions would be better answered on a vending forum. Most of the people on this board are knowledgable on the beverages themselves, not in the intricates of vending machines. I myself, along with many others have some knowledge of machines but would not classify it as industy expertise."
I beg to differ with you on this one. I am of the understanding that The BEV NET is a magazine for the beverage industry as a whole. This will surely encompass all those persons that sell beverages whether it be off a truck, in the cooler, out of a vending machine, etc. RBNA is a beverage company that sells beverages to resellers. If they feel that the way to grow their business is through vending machines then more power to them. After all, didn't Coke and Pepsi eventually move into the Vending game per se? Would not consider them able participants on this board?
Furthermore, If someone asks how to price their energy drink product in an "ENERGY DRINK" forum I think that is one good place to start to garner valuable information. It's just not about taste and how many oz's a drink should be that is important.
People come to this board because they feel it can provide them with information that is useful to their own professional/personal goals. Why should someone else(other than The BevNet administrators) decide who gets to come here and who doesn't?
If you don't like these peoples post ignore them, don't respond, etc.
04-14-2006, 03:14 PM
It's good Friday, 25 years ago I along with 12 or so dorm mates had the most intense psychedelic party ever held at the University of Illinois dorms. You see nearly the entire dorm went home for the Easter holiday.
12 guys and I had an open hall way all weekend trip,stone and drunk party; we had a back gammon rotating tournament that lasted for nearly a day. We had a pow- wow room for wampum ceremonies. We broke into the cafeteria and stole some much needed food.
We all did this as a group. Some of us did not get along too well. But this one weekend was magical. That weekend was special, we partied as a team and as unified dorm floor.
My point to this story is that we wanted to party and have a great time. We wanted to make it work.
Ok, we were very stoned but we wanted to make it work. LOL
This is my sentiment for these threads. Do we want it to work and will the stronger party want the second to last word?
[ 04-14-2006, 02:39 PM: Message edited by: Mr Zabe ]
Originally posted by Mr Zabe:
It's good Friday, 25 years ago I along with 12 or so dorm mates had the most intense psychedelic party ever held at the University of Illinois dorms. You see nearly the entire dorm went home for the Easter holiday. You always make me smile, Mr Zabe. ;)
04-14-2006, 04:14 PM
not if we bought them from the folks that bought from CC originally.
04-14-2006, 05:13 PM
My husband has been in vending for 10 years and did his research before buying from CC. He actually called RBNA and verifyed that CC had the authority to sell Red Bull Vendors. Other than the fact that the vendors were overpriced and the estimated sales were exxagerated, CC came through on everything promised. My greatest fear was that no vending machines or product would be delivered. I persoanlly contacted CC about their not delivering the vendors within the time period that they advertised. My husband was refunded for two sub par locations that were located by Coastal Locaters. CC refunded half of what two other machines would have cost to be located, even though my husband did the locating himself. I think CC overextended themselves and was too overwhelmed by the response. I do hope RBNA will help the vendors who bought from CC. The impression I got from my husband's phone call to RBNA yesterday was that he was on his own. IMO, RBNA should stand behind the vendors who purchased these machines from CC in good faith that they had an agreement with CC.
Originally posted by MrsRedBull:
I do hope RBNA will help the vendors who bought from CC. The impression I got from my husband's phone call to RBNA yesterday was that he was on his own. IMO, RBNA should stand behind the vendors who purchased these machines from CC in good faith that they had an agreement with CC. I received a call from RBNA. From them, not me initiating the call. Their call was very reassuring. Before this I had spoken with my local Distrbutor who had put alot of my fears to rest on this. NOTHING has changed. If you are already dealing with your local distributor for product, then they will be your contact for product and for additional machine purchases. The only exception to this being good news is maybe those who have distributors who also place and service machines, in which case there are some unique complications there. My distributor, however, is solely distribution. They're anxious, as was RBNA from our conversation, to continue a long and mutually beneficial relationship with their existing vendors.
In fact, it's rather exciting news, at least where we are located. My distributor has really taken the reins on this, and has been in contact with me several times for various things. He is anxious to try to see if the vendors he currently services would be interested in meeting at their offices and becoming familiar with each other and our territories. He had lots of ideas on how to expand our presence and further our routes and the brand.
I'm not sure who your husband talked to at RBNA, but there's a good chance that he may have spoken with someone who was not initimately familiar with the details. Calls in to RBNA will sometimes get you in touch with people who are willing to give you answers to questions for which they don't have all the details. RBNA, I'm told is contacting all of the vendors who went through CC to explain the split and to allay any fears they may have about their future with the company. The manager I spoke with was very candid about their ideas for the future of the program, and why the current program was terminated. If I may, I'd suggest calling your local distributor for information, since you can be sure, they have been in contact with folks at RBNA who are initimately familiar with the circumstances and the new process. Your distributor should ALWAYS be your first stop.
edit: Here's something else to consider. If RBNA was just interested in selling vending machines, and not in developing and growing their vending presence, they would have let CC keep on doing what they were doing. It is in their interests, your distributors interests, and your interests that you be successful in your endeavor. The success is, of course dependent on you, but with respect to support and resources - things just got better, not worse.
[ 04-14-2006, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: Veruca Vending ]
04-14-2006, 07:53 PM
im trying to figure out why i read 39 out of the last 40 posts...lol. Some posts are off topic- like that is uncommon. Energy drink thread, energy drink vending, so what...Only thing i don't like is a similiar discussion coming up in more and more threads heheh.
I look forward to what my local distributor will say about the machines now that CC is out of the picture.